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Next Trophy Class - Classic Mustangs

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wixwacing
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Next Trophy Class - Classic Mustangs

Post by wixwacing »

On this occasion I have chosen the class for the next “Slotcar Legends” trophy series. This will commence the month after the conclusion of the successful ‘Unmarked Supercar’ class. This will be Classic Mustangs up to 1973. The class will be open to all 1/32 scale models of Mustangs in this range. For ease of application, the general class guidelines are as follows :

Slotcar Legends Trophy Class
Classic Mustangs
Motor class ‘B’

1. Bodies will be 'hardbodied', (Plastic moulded, Resin moulded or metal)

2. Models will represent 1/1 classic Ford Mustangs (Racing or Street legal) from inception to 1973.

3. Models will be true scale as close as possible and be recognisable as such, and will carry interior detail, at least half a driver figure and steering wheel.

4. Models will have transparent windows all round.

5. Motors can be any make but restricted to 18,000 rpm @ 12.0 volts (21,000 @ 14.0 volts).

6. Final drive ratio will not be higher than 3 : 1

7. Motors will be readily recognisable and distinguishable. (On complaint, spurious motors will eliminate the model from the rankings (but not from racing).

8. Wheels can be plastic or metal.

9. Substitute metal wheels and tyres will be no wider than the plastic wheels and tyres.

10. In the case of a model having very thin wheels and tyres, they may be increased in width. No model will have a tyre tread area width of more than 9.0 millimetres (standard Scalextric dimension)

11. Any make tyres can be used

12. No part of either front or rear wheels (inc tyre) may protrude from the body when viewed from above.

13. Models will have no more than four wheels.

14. Traction magnets are acceptable for plastic tracks. The magnet must NOT be able to support the model when inverted on a section of track similar to that used on race night.

15. Models will be able to carry unlimited extra weight in the form of ballast material.

16. Models will carry only one slot guide and two braids. No other part of the model, except the tyres, will touch any part of the track at any time.

17. Races will consist of four heats per race on four laned tracks and three heats per race on three laned tracks.

18. Total race time will be calculated as near as possible to twelve minutes. i.e. 4 X 3 minute heats or 3 X 4 minute heats. Based on the performance of a mid fielder.

19. Points will be awarded to compliant race finishers on the basis of 20 pts for 1st place, 19 pts for second, 18 pts for third etc. etc.

20. The race will be run over six rounds

21. Contestants’ BEST five rounds will be tallied for their final points total. This includes DNA’s*

22. The winner will be the driver who has accumulated the highest amount of points after adjustments at the end of round six.

23. There will be a trophy for highest points tally for best driver, overall class and a trophy for highest points tally for best driver, class B.

24. There will also be a trophy for the best driver on aggregate from group A and group B. i.e. the driver with the highest average points tally, based on a minimum of four rounds.

25. All other Slotcar Legends guidelines which do not contradict this class guide apply. Anything not mentioned in the guidelines will be deemed not applicable

*DNA – Did not arrive.


The guidelines will be subject to updating without notice should any person be seen trying to circumvent the guidelines against the spirit of the event, or if genuine unseen anomalies are encountered.
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When I'm not racing slotcars,
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When I win, it's because of my talent, not my car or my controller!
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kenneth
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Re: Next Trophy Class - Classic Mustangs

Post by kenneth »

Phil can i put a metal chassis under my Carrera mustang body ??
Say like an MJK chassis!
`It is better to enter a turn slow & come out fast, than to enter a turn fast & come out dead` Ferry Porsche
wixwacing
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Re: Next Trophy Class - Classic Mustangs

Post by wixwacing »

Hi Kenneth

Technically, sheet metal chassis aren't allowed in Legends racing (as you pointed out to me once,) This is because it allows the centre of gravity of a model to be pitched a lot lower than plastic chassied models. In this particular case, if it was the MJK adjustable chassis with the side mount tongues, like the FJ and EH chassis, I would say yes give it a go, but if it is the womp style flat metal plate chassis then no.
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When I'm not racing slotcars,
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When I win, it's because of my talent, not my car or my controller!
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kenneth
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Re: Next Trophy Class - Classic Mustangs

Post by kenneth »

wixwacing wrote:Technically, sheet metal chassis aren't allowed in Legends racing (as you pointed out to me once,) This is because it allows the centre of gravity of a model to be pitched a lot lower than plastic chassied models. In this particular case, if it was the MJK adjustable chassis with the side mount tongues, like the FJ and EH chassis, I would say yes give it a go, but if it is the womp style flat metal plate chassis then no.
Thanks Phil - i thought that was the case, as the guide lines state RTR plastic/resin cars etc.
But what makes the MJK one accectable please.
if i have 8.43mm wheels and the tyres are 9.6mm i assume they are not permitted, just a bit perplexed as to why a metal chassis can be homologated for the series. Image
Sorry to be pedantic , but after reading you report from Eggys where 9.5mm tyres were frowned upon and a metal chassis allowed. Image
`It is better to enter a turn slow & come out fast, than to enter a turn fast & come out dead` Ferry Porsche
paulthetexan
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Re: Next Trophy Class - Classic Mustangs

Post by paulthetexan »

Hey

I have to say I agree with you Jordan . Metal Chassis , Alloy wheels/no inserts , silicone tyres . It goes against every thing our clubs have been trying to promote , plastic RTR cars . It doesn't seem to be in the spirit of the event . Al did have the choice to buy a better car from the start , would have been cheaper also .

But this is part of a bigger issue wich affects a few of the participants , eg: MJK / HRS chassis cars also.

Keep in mind that we are a small group of blokes who see each other quite regularly and bending the rules to gain some advantage ( or worse still , totally ignoring them) will cause friction among us . It's like cheating against your brother in a game of back yard football , there's no real point to it . The only outcome is someone always feels cheated , and won't want to play next time you ask them .

Everyone knows whats going on with each others cars because we are an open and friendly group of people , which is probably why we had 19 turn up last meet . Also knowbody wants to be confrontational about it at the event . Once again easy going freindly blokes , but it only goes on for so long before friction builds . Goony got chased out of the room over 0.5mm of tyre and then Al races a super modified all night only to be vindicated on appeal . Just doesn't seem right !

The rules are quite clear for all to follow .

Stick to the rules Gents and we'll all have more fun .

Paul
Go hard or Go home
wixwacing
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Re: Next Trophy Class - Classic Mustangs

Post by wixwacing »

G’day Guys

I appreciate your concern with the application of some of the guide lines. It takes a lot of feedback, deliberation and research before the guidelines are either changed or overruled for a specific event. Debate can only be healthy for the hobby and the more feedback I get the better.

Above all else it is important that parity is maintained between drivers and classes on race night. Slotcar Legends is a group for all pockets and abilities and the first and foremost necessity is that no racer can obtain track advantage by spending unreasonable amounts of money on a model. That would be unfair to the fifty percent of guys who are on minimal disposable incomes and restricted budgets. Indeed, money can be spent in great quantities if so desired, but it must not improve the performance of the model beyond the RTR class norm.

We allow wheels to be replaced with alloys, providing they are using some type of insert, or are ‘fashioned’ wheels, comparable with the model class. This was introduced because RTR models invariably now come with almost perfect wheels. Some models like Slot.it and NSR now come exclusively with alloys. Gone are the days when eccentricity and run out were a curse. So, it is deemed that metal wheels are not an advantage any longer when compared to the mainstream competitive RTR models like Flyslot, Scalextric, Ninco Pioneer etc. etc…… Indeed, some Legends racers replace their model’s spoked wheels with BRM wheels and tyres to enhance its appearance, spending in excess of sixty dollars for virtually no measurable performance gain!!

We allow tyres to be changed for a couple of reasons. Firstly, some models leave the factory with woefully inadequate tyres and the simple process of changing a model’s tyres, at minimal expense, will allow that model to perform comparably with other ‘out of the box’ models in that class. The second plus is that by making a model more drivable, we increase the diversity of models on the track which is always good for the group. I always look forward to which Porsche Jordan will race at each event, even though sometimes it might have ly been behind the eight ball as an out of the box RTR model.’

We allow ballast also for similar reasons. I can’t imagine there are many models raced on our board tracks without at least five grams to balance the model. Lead is the cheapest of tuning accessories and the few dollars it does cost does not present a prohibitive threat for those who have to count their pennies. Some of our local racers who are on tight budgets seem to be the ones with the most lead in their cars anyway!

A case history

Before we started the Unmarked Supercars series, one of our number popped along to his local slotcar store and allowed the proprietor to sell him a model for the class. This gentleman is on a strict slotcar budget and a wrong decision would impact severely on his prospects in his group. Needless to say, the model was far less than suitable and on the running of the first round the racer was extremely disappointed in the model and frustrated at his financial inability to replace it. I took the model home and balanced the model’s weight with some extra ballast and fitted, at my expense, some different rear tyres. I got the model to perform respectably for the level of ability of the driver and the model and racer turned up at all the later rounds of the event with the owner being happy at his performance compared to his group peers. This happened because the guidelines allow a model to be brought ‘up to spec.’ as opposed to exceeding it. Spec. being the average performance of the leading RTR models. It also gave the racer a reason to come back!

The Slotcar Legends guidelines has a proviso for scratchbuilt cars, as there are an ever increasing number who like to tinker with their models to varying degrees. These have been formulated to ensure the model has no greater advantage over ‘spec’ RTR models. Up to last season, metal chassis of any kind were not allowed, regardless of their composition. I fell foul of this with one of my Historic GP models which has a square tube chassis. I have not raced it since, preferring to run newer scratchbuilt models like my Maserati 250F with a PCB chassis. Having built and run adjustable chassis’ I know the good ones from the not so good ones, and this is why the MJK adjustable chassis, as used in the FJ and EH kits has been allowed in the ‘Classic Mustang’ series.

These chassis are (and I’m sure Ian of MJK wouldn’t mind me saying) quite basic and not a threat. They are not a flat plate ‘womp’ style chassis but a laser cut stainless steel folded metal chassis of several pieces, with rudimentary axle mounts and motor and guide mounts. I consider this chassis to fall under the ‘Plastic or similar’ description in the guidelines. The use of this chassis in a model would be unlikely to bring it up to the spec of a leading RTR! In Alan’s case, the chassis replace the Carrera chassis the model had and the replacement tyres were within the guidelines. The model drove well but fell a little short of the performance levels of the spec models. Alan’s decision to race an MJK chassis was to give him a model which could compete reasonably well in the class rather than be a hopeless ‘also ran’ as it would have been with its chassis. The expense he incurred did not give him an unfair advantage over the rest of his group. The fact that he finished fourteenth overall and last in his group is pretty conclusive evidence.

Lastly, the tyre regulations were clearly laid out in the Classic Mustang guidelines. No tyre to exceed 9.0 m.m. width. This is the width of the Scaley mustangs and slightly wider than the Pioneer mustangs (8.8 m.m.) The use of wider tyres on a spec model would give the model an unfair advantage over the norm. Tyre width is a major contributor to acceleration and cornering. The wider tyre surface presented to the track increases traction. On acceleration, the extra rubber in contact with the track surface generates extra grip more or less in proportion to the extra width of the tyre, e.g. A 0.5 m.m. increase in tyre width from the 9.0 m.m spec gives a theoretical grip increase of 5.55% barring mechanical and other losses. This extra traction also influences the amount of grip available when a model is cornering, even when it generates no extra stability. (That is mostly influenced by axle width and centre of gravity). This is deemed to be an unfair advantage and would cause an extra added expense to other racers who would want to increase the RTR spec of their model. The 9.0 m.m. guideline was used in the first instance so that those who chose (and there were a few), could race with the model’s tyres without being handicapped. It was also tabled well in advance of the event. The person who used the wider tyres initially must not have been aware of that guideline until it was pointed out to him.

So basically, although we profess it, we don’t run ‘box standard’ models! There are guys who like to change this and change that. They have come from other race groups who allow open slather on model specs, and open wallets too. We cater to these guys because we know the allowed mods may improve a lesser model but do not allow it to surpass a class leading RTR model. And they come back time and again. There are guys as already mentioned, who don’t have deep pockets and are on tight budgets, these guys can race assured of the fact that their model and the minimal amount they can wisely spend on it assures them of being competitive in their group. And they come back, time and time again. There are guys who are genuinely novices and have not yet accomplished the art of setting a model up. They can simply apply the few mods we do allow, and it puts their mind at rest that they are not for ever banished to the realms of back marker because they cannot keep up with the changes. And they come back time and time again. And there are those who have been ‘out there’ in slotcar land and didn’t like what they saw because it was unregulated, unscrutinized and a free for all, and they come back time and time again.

The Trophy class in its short history has always been a stand alone class. This allows room for a little artistic license in model preparation and not the strictures of our set classes. What guidelines that are applied to the trophy class do not run over into other events raced on the same or other evenings. The ‘Track owners choice’ is simply that. A class that the track owner would like to see raced on his track. All the basic class guidelines still apply. The set class assures there is a fair distribution and running of classes which might not be first choice in other circumstances. These are chosen from classes that may have not been run for a while.

So, the few mods that have been allowed for the Trophy class have, as mentioned before, been carefully considered to promote discussion and interest, and to not let the group languish in same old same oldness, and not to abandon the needs of the several different slotracing styles the group members enjoy. The numbers of racers now turning up are a testimony to that and hopefully this discussion, and many more like it, will help shape the way we approach our hobby as an expanding group and not reduce us to a segregated bunch of home ‘hermit racers’ as we have seen not so many years ago in our local history.
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When I'm not racing slotcars,
I'm out in the back yard, burning food!!

When I win, it's because of my talent, not my car or my controller!
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kenneth
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Re: Next Trophy Class - Classic Mustangs

Post by kenneth »

Phil thanks for your response, but it`s all a bit a Ferrari interpretion of the rules to me.
So the bottom line is - if the driver can`t gain performance from the upgrade then it is OK, so if Paul ran an MJK chassis and wins it`s OK?? Paul can win with a ballasted tuned Carrera chassis,, so if he gains an advantage by running the MJK metal chassis and cleans up - it`s all good then?
I`m not the best driver out there and i don`t spend extra money on cars and i spend what time i can tuning cars, it`s not a great priority for me, i often turn up to meets without having prepped a car , but thats my fault, so if i come in at the end of the list so what - like Eggy says `slot cars are the winners on the night`.
I go to talk & race with like minded hobby enthusiasts and we aren`t racing for sheep stations.
If i ran 9.5mm tyres do you really think i`m, gonna beat the likes of norm, phil, paul, perro, Peter S, Eggy ,et al??
But it`s a rule and i will abide by it, but according to your reasoning , if i don`t gain an advantage for running wider tyres it`s OK.
So you don`t reckon the metal chassis would lower the centre of gravity of a car that normally had a carrera chassis, but he`s not coming in at the pointy end so it`s OK.
Sounds like a Ferrari interpretation of the rules to me. :lol: :lol:
No Metal chassis means No metal chassis!!
Just like 18K means 18K in motor classes, not other brands cars with higher rpm motors with crap gearing, even though you gain no advantage because braking is compromised.
I`m pretty tolereant, but as i stated before no metal means no metal - i don`t care how underperforming they are.
If i built a metal chassis it would more than likely be pretty crap , if not a handicap to me, but we are not Allowed via the rules to run a metal chassis.
If you want to run one then no points - simple, if you come last then thats fine, if you come in the top ten - no points.
Not trying to stir the pot, but rules is rules, no rules is OK if you are not winning.
`It is better to enter a turn slow & come out fast, than to enter a turn fast & come out dead` Ferry Porsche
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